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Old 02 Jan 2011, 19:32   #21
SMC
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In sfarsit... cineva!
Te iubesc, zgubi...
Da io zic sa nu te prea aventurezi cu laude la "chestii' de mine scrise - nu de alta, da' sa nu te desfinteze detractorii, mai mult sau mai putin avizati - dupa propriile lor considerente, desigur...
Mai bine zi-mi asta intr-un p.m.
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Old 02 Jan 2011, 23:59   #22
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Hai mai da'te si tu jos de pe piedestal, Luminatia Ta!
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 02:46   #23
omudindulap
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Unde disparu mesajul lui djinjis? Iar incepem sa cenzuram?!
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 02:48   #24
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Disciple, nu-i strica bucuria .
SMC, revino on-topic. Vad unde bati, asa ca te rog nu instiga la off-topicuri si la atacuri.


Va rog sa criticati cronicile sau pseudo-cronicele, whatever, in limitele bunului simt. Intr-adevar, recenzia lui SMC e cam siropoasa, cel putin pentru gusturile mele, dar nu e cazul sa se foloseasca exprimari grosolane pentru a o ataca. Bine, nu am citit-o pana la capat, fiindca incerc sa evit putinele spoilere care mi-au mai ramas de evitat , dar prima fraza mi-a taiat complet elanul. Nu spun ca nu are dreptate djinjis, dar putea sa o scrie si altfel...
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 03:29   #25
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d c mea fost ster urmatorul mesaj?

(Trivialitäti si jigniri gratuite)
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 03:50   #26
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Puteai sa spui urmatoarele intr-un alt mod, mai delicat...sau deloc
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(Trivialitäti si jigniri gratuite)


Cam asta ar fi tot ce e in neregula cu mesajul . Tonul face muzica...in principiu parerea mea coincide cu a ta, nu sunt un mare fan al recenziilor lui SMC, dar ce faci tu e deja atac la persoana si cu asta nu sunt de acord. Orice tentativa de a pune paie pe foc va fi stearsa, asa ca nu continuati cu asta. I warned you!

PS: Tu iti salvezi mereu mesajele, preventiv, in caz ca cineva ti le sterge? Apropo, iti multumesc din nou pentru spoilere, zau asa ...
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 04:45   #27
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"bah" e de pe net, nus c vorbesc aia n bucale si nici nu vreu sa aflu. am o lunga esperienta cu mesajele sterse, intreaba-l pe bulla, cum ii spun pretenii intre ei, deci salvez tot c frige. am studiat sublinierile tale si declar ca o sa ma gindesc la ele. nu-tz fa probleme pentru spoilere, oricum finalul e evident inca de la generic.
nu mai sta noaptea ca o sa faci cearcane si n-o sa mai vrea pretendentu' sa te prinza de popou.
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 06:51   #28
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Daca te plangi ca finalul e previzibil esti pe o pista gresita din start. Zi-mi un balet cu un final imprevizibil, unul.
Pentru ca datele probelemei sunt date inca din primele zece minute, nimic din film nu incearca sa se ascunda pe dupa degete, nu pretinde ca nu va fi un final previzibil, nu pretinde ca nu stim povestea deja. E o reinterpretare de la Lacul Lebedelor, sub forma unui thriller psihologic. Functioneaza perfect in limitele astea, nu e vina lui Aronofsky ca tu ai o problema cu intregul mod de abordare si fidelitatea fata de concept. Baletul devine o metafora pentru film, sau mai exact, filmmaking, in cazul de fata. Dar din unghiul tau obtuz de trol suprem cred ca stau un pic altfel lucrurile.
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 11:49   #29
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Acum a väzut si Omuldindulap mârläniile pe care i le stersesem individului.
Le sterg din nou.
Djinjis, ai un avertisment. Scrie civilizat, sau zbori.
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 13:52   #30
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vam spus ca declar ca ma concentrez la rugamintile voastre, c atata graba? am editat din nou

"sacrificiul suprem pe altarul artei sportive"

ce sacrificiu suprem, bre, ca s-a shmenuit cu ciobu la ombilic?

un indeaproape observator al pasiunii, ce treptat, ia forma spectaculos-estetica a vointelor launtrice a protagonistului insusi"

pasiunea nu era vointa launtrica, ci devine pe parcurs? sau te-ai prins ce vrea aia doar pe la jumate?

"intr-o sugerata lupta contra paranoiei"

c sugerata, ca ti-o arata mai sa ti-o vire in ochi. ia mai verifica tu dex-ul.

"si propriilor ambitii"

ba pe dos, isi urmeaza ambitiile bine mersi.

"aproape lipsita de transcendenta"

...

"ce incearca o anumita identificare cu un spectator derutat "

oare cine, oare cine...

" pentru ca mai apoi, totul sa devina atat de uman, atat de justificat"

aia e gata sa comita crima, se automutileaza etc. asta e partea umana? delirezi? du-te si omoara si tu pe cineva, poate scrii si tu ceva inteligibil, ca doar e justificat, nu?

""in the end", sa copleseasca. "

finalul e previzibil si de doi lei.

bla bla bla panglicari.



miercur

inclusiv poveste din lacul lebedelor e buna. din balet. doar ca, din nou, noi nu vorbim despre balet ci despre un film.

"Baletul devine o metafora pentru film, sau mai exact, filmmaking"

nu e o metafora ci un pretext / cum scrie si in dex. eu vreau sa-mi descrii c inseamna la tine " metafora mult mai mare". (as fi curios de asemenea sa-mi spui si care e cea mai mare metafora dintre toate) nu vreau sa-mi spui ca e metafora pentru aia sau ailalta ci vreau efectiv sa-mi descrii metafora. sper ca am fost clar de data asta.

si din unghiul meu obtuz de trol suprem o sa-ti postez mai jos sinopsisul lacului lebedelor sa stii si tu despre c e vorba.

Act I
A magnificent park before a castle.
Swan Lake begins at a royal court. Prince Siegfried, heir to the kingdom, must declare he has chosen a wife at his birthday ball. Upset that he cannot marry for love, Siegfried makes for the forest and escapes into the night. He sees a flock of swans flying overhead and sets off in pursuit of them.

Act 2
A mountainous wild place, surrounded by forest. In the distance a lake, on the right side of which are ruins. A moonlit night.

Siegfried aims his crossbow at the swans and readies himself for their landing by the lakeside. When one comes into view, however, he stops. Before him is a beautiful creature dressed in white feathers, more woman than swan. Enamoured, the two dance and Siegfried learns that the swan maiden is the princess Odette. An evil sorcerer, von Rothbart, has captured her and used his magic to turn her into a swan by day. Every night, she becomes a woman again.
A retinue of other captured swan-maidens attend Odette in the environs of Swan Lake, which was formed by the tears of her parents when she was kidnapped by von Rothbart. Once Siegfried knows her story, he takes great pity on her and falls in love. As he begins to swear his love to her, an act that will render the sorcerer's spell powerless, von Rothbart himself appears. Siegfried threatens to kill von Rothbart but Odette intercedes. If von Rothbart dies before the spell is broken, it can never be undone.

Act 3
An opulent hall in the castle.

The Prince returns to the castle to attend the ball. Von Rothbart arrives in disguise with his own daughter Odile. He has made Odile identical to Odette in all respects except that she wears black rather than white. The prince mistakes her for Odette, dances with her, and proclaims to the court that he intends to make her his wife. Only a moment too late, Siegfried sees the real Odette and realizes his mistake. (The method in which Odette appears varies. In some versions she arrives at the castle, while in other versions von Rothbart shows Siegfried a magical vision of her.)

Act 4
Same scene by the lake as in Act 2.
Siegfried returns to the lake and finds Odette. He makes a passionate apology and she forgives him. Von Rothbart appears and tries to pull the lovers apart. The two realize, because of Siegried's accidental pledge to Odile, the spell cannot be broken. In order to stay together, Odette and Siegfried kill themselves by leaping into the lake and drown. This causes von Rothbart to lose his power over them, and he dies as a result.


daca vrei iti mai postez si niste alternative endings.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JD177l2DNtw
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Old 03 Jan 2011, 15:18   #31
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^Asa mai merge, vad ca progresam .
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Old 05 Jan 2011, 02:07   #32
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Care parte din "nu mai puneti paie pe foc" nu ati inteles-o? Yes rifa, au fost jigniri gratuite. Te-ai bagat si tu in discutie, ignorand faptul ca am zis sa incetati cu asta. Pentru ca sunt obiectiva sau ma rog, incerc sa fiu, tin sa mentionez faptul ca ce i-am spus lui djinjis e valabil si pentru tine. Nu vei avea parte de tratament special doar pentru ca djinjis are deja "cazier" la noi .

Sa nu cumva sa va plangeti ca au disparut mesajele voastre, v-am spus ca le voi sterge. Incerc sa nu moderez abuziv si sa cenzurez la greu, dar atacurile personale nu-si au locul aici, iar djinjis chiar s-a straduit sa demonstreze (cu chiu, cu vai ) ca se poate ataca un text fara sa fie atacata si persoana care l-a scris.

Acestea fiind scrise, back on topic please. Parca vorbeam de Black Swan, nu?
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Old 06 Jan 2011, 20:46   #33
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What Britain's ballet stars made of Black Swan
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Old 10 Jan 2011, 13:54   #34
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3 lucruri tin acest film legat: Portman, imaginea si montajul. Restul bate in livresc si teatral (Grand Guignol?).

8 / 10 (bun)
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Old 11 Jan 2011, 12:29   #35
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Incepe simplu, creste in intensitate si termina impecabil...
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Old 26 Jan 2011, 13:16   #36
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WARNING: SPOILERS

Mi'au placut foarte mult coloana sonora si, desigur, Natalie Portman.Nu cred ca poate pune cineva la indoiala jocul sau actoricesc din acest film.A fost impecabila incepand cu tinuta si terminand cu toate starile pe care reuseste sa le redea extraordinar de bine.
N'o fi Cassel Al Pacino, dar are un farmec aparte si nu a jucat rau deloc.
Mila Kunis, sa fim seriosi..!Doar i s'a potrivit mult mai bine personajul datorita fizicului si atitudinii sale.Rol memorabil??Da, se poate spune si asa din moment ce nu cred ca o sa aiba un rol mai impresionant in cariera ei, dar om trai s'om vedea.
Sustin ideea cum ca finalul a fost absurd.A dansat cu ciobul in stomac 5 ore (vorba vine), apoi a realizat ce se intampla, a mai dansat ce'a mai dansat pentru ca apoi, in 5 secunde, sa sangereze cat un elefant.Mda.
Este unul dintre cele mai bune filme ale anului, clar.Dar, mie mi'a placut mult mai mult 127 Hours.Si il vad, fara doar si poate, peste TSN.
Darren Aronofsky si'a dovedit genialitatea in nenumarate filme si eram sigura ca nu ma va dezamagi nici de aceasta data, chiar daca au existat mici nemultumiri fata de Black Swan'ul sau.
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Old 08 Feb 2011, 00:42   #37
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Foarte frumos filmul lui Aronofsky. Din perspectiva unui om care a facut balet (chiar daca doar pentru cateva luni) pot spune ca Natalie s-a descurcat absolut formidabil cu niste lucruri pe care oricat le-ai repeta nu ai cum sa le inveti. Ar merita Oscarul si daca filmul nu ar fi despre o dedublare, din simplul motiv ca se urca pe poante si se misca extrem de gratios.
M-a facut sa privesc cu alti ochi artistii care incearca sa portretizeze simultan un pozitiv si un negativ, si din punctul asta de vedere mi-ar fi placut ca personajul principal sa nu fie atat de predispusa la nebunie (mama exagerata, izolarea de restul etc).
M-a surprins initial stilul usor neprelucrat de la inceput pentru ca ma asteptam ca un film-spectacol sa aibe o imagine impecabila. Dar m-am adaptat foarte repede si deja dupa prima serie de cadre nu mai vedeam pixelii.

Oricum, jos palaria pentru Aronofsky care e un regizor constant bun in conditiile in care abordeaza subiecte extrem de variate.
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Old 08 Feb 2011, 03:28   #38
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How Do I Cliché Thee?

How do you destroy a ballet thriller? Start by hiring Darren Aronofsky, continue by casting non-dancers

Portman was lacking in the lead role. For any one of you who have experienced the aura surrounding a prima ballerina, then you know of what I speak. There is an elegance about them that transcends all cultural boundaries, a sense of grace divine if you will.

Self indulgence from the director flows' the camera moves no more than a yard from Portman throughout the movie, constantly circling her and leaving everything else out. They may as well have not bothered with a set at all. Hang on...Was there a set?

A conflation of the *worst* parts of THE RED SHOES performed without actual dancers (three minutes of details of ballerinas working on their toe shoes do NOT equal 30 seconds of actual DANCE)

We fought our way through the season's first serious snow storm in New York to see BLACK SWAN, much praised (in some quarters) for reasons which I can only conclude have something to do with the silent movie style reliance on close-ups - one gathers a Darren Aronofsky trademark - to disguise the fact that this "ballet" film has almost no actual dancing except in the background because the leads *can't* - getting there and home again was the fun part. For anyone with any actual frame of reference either in the ballet or modern film, the movie was simply dreadful.


Even the MUSICAL direction is poor, frittering away the great Tchaikovsky themes in Clint Mansell's lame adaptation which rarely was allowed to soar except in the movie title segment of the actual performance of SWAN LAKE (leads only shown from the chest up) to help give the impression Ms. Portman's acting is supposed to, and scared far less than even middling work in an average Hitchcock film.

She is a one note pony, this swan. Her facial expression never varies from sad, purse-mouthed and leaky eyed. I got so tired of looking at her face. To top it off, I felt absolutely no interest in any of the cast as the movie wound excruciatingly along on its hopeless execrable way to nowhere.

However, it wasn't clear to me why choreographer chose this brittle virgin for the part, taking an enormous risk in an enormous spotlight when it was clear that she wasn't up to her sensual counterpart, that she was increasingly unstable, and I got tired of the constant rehearsals where this was pointed out.

Portman does her usual dance between two poles - anguished to stony faced, which she has been doing since Leon. Literally she used the same expression as she did at the door in Leon several times here. She was not convincing in this part for me at all. I also found Winona Ryder to be quite ridiculous and a little like the Wicked Midget Witch of the West

I felt as if Aronofsky and Natalie Portman could only visualize two sides to Nina : the "white" swan and the "black" swan

After watching the trailer for the first time, I asked my friend "Do you think Natalie Portman's character has split personality disorder and the "horror" scenes are simply imagined?" Turns out, I had figured out the plot before I had even watched the movie.

The lack of script is a serious flaw: she vomits, she slashes herself, she lives with her mother, she has lesbian sex - sorta, but she has no background, no character, apart from mommy's girl, no friends, no interactions with others apart from the briefest of convos about ballet. The mother is cardboard - with a standard melodramatic dialogue - "I gave up my career for you, boo-hoo me".



si asa mai departe.
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Old 08 Feb 2011, 04:34   #39
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SPOILERS

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How do you destroy a ballet thriller? Start by hiring Darren Aronofsky, continue by casting non-dancers

De acelasi lucru s-a plans lumea si la Sweeney Todd, ca de ce nu au angajat persoane capabile sa cante pe Broadway. Chestia e ca atat Sweeney, cat si Black Swan sunt FILME, prin urmare aveau nevoie de actori care sa si cante/danseze, nu invers. Nu e acelasi lucru sa pui un dansator sa interpreteze sau sa pui un actor sa danseze. Nathalie was acting while dancing si pentru mine, asta a contat. She had grace si daca nu as sti mai bine, s-ar putea da drept balerina si m-ar convinge. Din punctul meu de vedere, metamorfoza ei dintr-o lebada alba in una neagra a fost perfecta. Vorbim aici de metamorfoza, fiindca in Nina, cele doua "lebede" nu puteau co-exista, ci una trebuia sa o elimine pe cealalta, astfel incat daca la inceput avem o lebada alba, prea rigida pentru a fi si una neagra, la sfarsit avem o lebada neagra care a uitat aproape complet de latura ei vulnerabila, de aici si sarutul acela de sfarsit, in care ea il domina complet pe Thomas, contrar situatiei de la inceputul filmului. Vincent mi s-a parut chiar carismatic in rol si contrar asteptarilor, personajul sau nu a fost libidinos - telul lui era de a o ajuta pe Nina sa-si exploreze sexualitatea, pentru a reda cat mai bine pe scena senzualitatea ceruta de rolul lebedei negre. In caz contrar, daca Thomas voia sa mearga mai departe, ar fi putut profita de moment cand a chemat-o la el in apartament de ex. Asa cum a spus si ricutza, filmul surprinde bine presiunea pusa pe o persoana care trebuie sa interpreteze doua roluri diametral opuse, cat si posibilele efecte distructive ale aspiratiei catre perfectiune, indiferent de care arta vorbim. Din momentul in care Nina spune ca voia doar sa fie la fel de perfecta precum Beth, stii ca aceasta sete o va termina atat fizic, cat si psihic. Relatia cu mama ei mi-a amintit putin de Pianista lui Haneke, ambele fiind sexually repressed. Apropo de asta, I laughed out loud la secventa cand Nina se masturbeaza in pat si observa ca mama dormea langa ea .


Quote:
After watching the trailer for the first time, I asked my friend "Do you think Natalie Portman's character has split personality disorder and the "horror" scenes are simply imagined?" Turns out, I had figured out the plot before I had even watched the movie.

LOL nu e ca si cum asta ar fi fost un twist. Surpriza nu e ca sufera de o boala, ci cum si de ce aceasta boala ia amploare. Filmul e mai degraba un character study, pe alocuri chiar disturbing. Pana si in plot se mentioneaza ca e vorba despre o balerina care incetul cu incetul isi pierde mintile.
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Old 08 Feb 2011, 09:05   #40
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Vad ca cineva se pricepe la munca de compilatie.
Urmatoarea data asteptam sa ni se explice cum medicii trebuie jucati de medici si politistii de politisti.
Quote:
After watching the trailer for the first time, I asked my friend "Do you think Natalie Portman's character has split personality disorder and the "horror" scenes are simply imagined?" Turns out, I had figured out the plot before I had even watched the movie.
Turns out people are completely missing the point. Agumentul asta e unul din cele mai imbecile si ma vad fortata sa recurg iarasi la analogia cu spectacolele de balet, you don't watch them for the plot, you watch them for the execution. Nimeni nu a incercat sa se ascunda dupa degete cu plotul asta, e intentionat usor de descifrat pentru ca se bazeaza pe o sursa foarte clara, arhetipala si foarte cunoscuta. Dar pentru unii e mai greu sa put two and two together, chiar daca se bat cu pumnii in piept ca i-a dus mintea suficient incat sa ghiceasca plotul de dinainte.

Happy trolling in continuare in tabara djinjis!
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